Discussion:
ow women's liberation began with Jesus
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burfordTjustice
2016-12-26 11:29:22 UTC
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How women's liberation began with Jesus

http://nyp.st/2h6PFiv
T
2016-12-27 19:57:22 UTC
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Post by burfordTjustice
How women's liberation began with Jesus
http://nyp.st/2h6PFiv
Hi Burford,

Indeed!

To add to the article, female converts to Christianity in
the early years outnumbers men by three to one.

And, the largest complaint wives have about their husbands
it that they don't listen to them. (Men's brains are wired
differently for speaking and listening.) What other religoun
commands husbands to listen to their wives?

And, what other religoun has as its favorite saint a woman
(beloved mother Mary)?

-T
burfordTjustice
2016-12-27 20:46:48 UTC
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On Tue, 27 Dec 2016 11:57:22 -0800
Post by T
Post by burfordTjustice
How women's liberation began with Jesus
http://nyp.st/2h6PFiv
Hi Burford,
Indeed!
To add to the article, female converts to Christianity in
the early years outnumbers men by three to one.
And, the largest complaint wives have about their husbands
it that they don't listen to them. (Men's brains are wired
differently for speaking and listening.) What other religoun
commands husbands to listen to their wives?
And, what other religoun has as its favorite saint a woman
(beloved mother Mary)?
-T
Most certainly not Islam...liberal women
and gays seem to miss the points of Islam...
Dev Null
2016-12-27 22:12:24 UTC
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Post by T
And, the largest complaint wives have about their husbands
it that they don't listen to them. (Men's brains are wired
differently for speaking and listening.) What other religoun
commands husbands to listen to their wives?
If God wanted man to listen to post-menopausal women,
why does he take a man's high frequency hearing as he ages?
T
2016-12-28 00:12:13 UTC
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Post by Dev Null
Post by T
And, the largest complaint wives have about their husbands
it that they don't listen to them. (Men's brains are wired
differently for speaking and listening.) What other religoun
commands husbands to listen to their wives?
If God wanted man to listen to post-menopausal women,
why does he take a man's high frequency hearing as he ages?
Tell your wife that she should yell at you when you
can't hear her. Wait. Forget I said that.

:'(
rbowman
2016-12-28 03:05:12 UTC
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Post by T
To add to the article, female converts to Christianity in
the early years outnumbers men by three to one.
The Christian community organizers knew what they were doing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithraism

Mithra was very popular in the legions but it was a boys only club. Mom
was left home with too much time on her hands and was recruited by the
Christians. When the old man got home she explained to him how it was
going to be if he ever expected to get a piece.

It always worked that way. Æthelberht was the first Christian English
king. He converted right after the little French hottie he married
explained the facts of life. Next thing you know, you've got Augustine
running around converting people.
rbowman
2016-12-28 03:14:51 UTC
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Post by T
Post by burfordTjustice
How women's liberation began with Jesus
http://nyp.st/2h6PFiv
Hi Burford,
Indeed!
To add to the article, female converts to Christianity in
the early years outnumbers men by three to one.
And, the largest complaint wives have about their husbands
it that they don't listen to them. (Men's brains are wired
differently for speaking and listening.) What other religoun
commands husbands to listen to their wives?
And, what other religoun has as its favorite saint a woman
(beloved mother Mary)?
-T
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_in_Islam


Many of the Protestant sects don't buy into the Catholic Mariology.
T
2016-12-28 03:39:26 UTC
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Post by rbowman
Many of the Protestant sects don't buy into the Catholic Mariology.
Hi Rbowman,

"Protestant" correctly do not think that Mary is a god. This comes
from some of the inappropriate displays of statuary in Catholic
churches: they "seem" to place Mary and Jesus on an
equal footing. They "seem" to do this other places as well.

But, try as you may, you will be hard pressed to find a Catholic
that thinks Mary is a god and is anything other than a beloved
Saint. It is a massive misunderstanding on the part of
Protestants. They really do need to speak to the Catholics
and find out what Catholics actually believe. (And don't
worry, their are enough out weird things for Protestants to be
scandalized over.)

But they calm down when reminded of what the Bible
says about Mary:

For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden
[Mary]: for, behold, from henceforth all generations
shall call me blessed.
-- Luke 1:48KJV

Beloved Mary has an enormous heart and will pray for anyone,
including me.

And all Christians need to understand that we are not each others
enemies. The enemy is Satin.

-T
rbowman
2016-12-28 05:58:00 UTC
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Post by T
But, try as you may, you will be hard pressed to find a Catholic
that thinks Mary is a god and is anything other than a beloved
Saint. It is a massive misunderstanding on the part of
Protestants. They really do need to speak to the Catholics
and find out what Catholics actually believe. (And don't
worry, their are enough out weird things for Protestants to be
scandalized over.)
Some denominations have liberalized but the more Calvinistic sects have
very little imagination. They are very close to the Muslims in their
attitude to religious art. In fact, they parse the ten commandments to
make sure to come down heavy on the graven image clause. Even the saint
thing rankles; intercession of a saint goes against the solas.

Many have no desire to know what Catholics really believe. In fact, the
Klan figured a Catholic would do if they couldn't find a handy negro.

I have personal theological issues but the Catholic Church did a pretty
good job of adapting to the soul of the northern Europeans when they
displaced the old Gods.
T
2016-12-30 01:53:50 UTC
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Post by rbowman
Post by T
But, try as you may, you will be hard pressed to find a Catholic
that thinks Mary is a god and is anything other than a beloved
Saint. It is a massive misunderstanding on the part of
Protestants. They really do need to speak to the Catholics
and find out what Catholics actually believe. (And don't
worry, their are enough out weird things for Protestants to be
scandalized over.)
Some denominations have liberalized but the more Calvinistic sects have
very little imagination.
It is a sadness that they dusted off one of the old heresies.
And apparently also a sadness that they have never been to a football
game: John 3-16

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only
Son, that *whoever* believes in him shall not perish but
have eternal life.

"whoever" really means "whoever". Not just those preselected.
Post by rbowman
They are very close to the Muslims in their
attitude to religious art.
They don't let the Bible get in their way either:

Ark of the Covenant

“They shall construct an ark of acacia wood ... You shall
make two cherubim of gold, make them of hammered work
[l]at the two ends of the mercy seat. Make one cherub
[m]at one end and one cherub [n]at the other end; you
shall make the cherubim of one piece with the mercy seat
at its two ends. 20 The cherubim shall have their wings
spread upward, covering the mercy seat with their wings
and [o]facing one another; the faces of the cherubim
are to be turned toward the mercy sea
--Exodus 25:10-22

Hmmm. Statues. Hmmmm. The first commandment must mean
no art depicting Bad Guys. Hmmmmmmmm.
Post by rbowman
In fact, they parse the ten commandments to
make sure to come down heavy on the graven image clause. Even the saint
thing rankles; intercession of a saint goes against the solas.
I find it bazaar that they pray for each other and get
scandalized if a saint is asked for their prayers.

They love their wives and husbands, even love their dogs,
and they get all apoplectic over loving someone that has
gone before.

And again, don't let the Bible get in their way.
Post by rbowman
Many have no desire to know what Catholics really believe.
It is sad that it seems to be a tenant of their faith
what others believe. Ask them? Not a chance!
Post by rbowman
In fact, the
Klan figured a Catholic would do if they couldn't find a handy negro.
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly.
Post by rbowman
I have personal theological issues but the Catholic Church did a pretty
good job of adapting to the soul of the northern Europeans when they
displaced the old Gods.
rbowman
2016-12-30 02:21:15 UTC
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Post by T
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly
Well, the Reformation wasn't a reformation, just an introduction of
theological novelties that ultimately fueled the Enlightenment.
Ultimately the Prods got what they deserved, a individualistic secular
society with the mainline protestant sects flat lining. Too bad the
Catholics chose to join the lemming leap after Vatican II. The last Mass
I went to, back in the '80s, might as well have been a Unitarian love feast.
T
2016-12-30 02:33:43 UTC
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Post by rbowman
Post by T
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly
Well, the Reformation wasn't a reformation, just an introduction of
theological novelties that ultimately fueled the Enlightenment.
Ultimately the Prods got what they deserved, a individualistic secular
society with the mainline protestant sects flat lining. Too bad the
Catholics chose to join the lemming leap after Vatican II. The last Mass
I went to, back in the '80s, might as well have been a Unitarian love feast.
Hi R,

It was unfortunate that the Reformation had to happen at all.
Had the Catholics not left the Church and remained true to
apostolic teaching and the Councils, the Reformation would have
never happened. And humanity would have not lost ~230,000 souls.

I remember the high Catholic mass when I was a kid (I was raised
Catholic). Much different now-a-days.

I much prefer the way the Ancient Church (Orthodox) does their
services. I have mainly only been able to watch it though.
I love Pascha (Easter) service where the priest sings out
"Christ is Risen!" and the choir blast back at him "Indeed
he is risen!" and then blast away (the priest lights the fuse).

In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...

:-)

-T
rbowman
2016-12-30 05:05:23 UTC
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Post by T
In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...
About the only time I remember a choir was the Christmas Eve High Mass
with all the bells and whistles, otherwise it was the plain vanilla Low
Mass. The phrase I always waited for was 'Ite, missa est.' to which i
could give a heartfelt 'Deo gratias!'
T
2016-12-30 05:34:39 UTC
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Post by rbowman
Post by T
In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...
About the only time I remember a choir was the Christmas Eve High Mass
with all the bells and whistles, otherwise it was the plain vanilla Low
Mass. The phrase I always waited for was 'Ite, missa est.' to which i
could give a heartfelt 'Deo gratias!'
Hi R,

I was pretty young. I only remember it was grand.

There are still Catholics out there that practice the traditional mass:

http://catholiclatinmass.org/traditional-latin-mass.html


This is an example of what the Ancient Church does (no one
got us beat on grandness):



Okay, I cheated a bit. The angles taught the Russians to Sing.

-T
Ophelia
2016-12-30 10:15:59 UTC
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Post by T
In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...
About the only time I remember a choir was the Christmas Eve High Mass
with all the bells and whistles, otherwise it was the plain vanilla Low
Mass. The phrase I always waited for was 'Ite, missa est.' to which i
could give a heartfelt 'Deo gratias!'

==================

We had 3 masses on Sundays but only the big one had the choir.
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk
Ophelia
2016-12-30 10:15:46 UTC
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Post by rbowman
Post by T
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly
Well, the Reformation wasn't a reformation, just an introduction of
theological novelties that ultimately fueled the Enlightenment.
Ultimately the Prods got what they deserved, a individualistic secular
society with the mainline protestant sects flat lining. Too bad the
Catholics chose to join the lemming leap after Vatican II. The last Mass
I went to, back in the '80s, might as well have been a Unitarian love feast.
Hi R,

It was unfortunate that the Reformation had to happen at all.
Had the Catholics not left the Church and remained true to
apostolic teaching and the Councils, the Reformation would have
never happened. And humanity would have not lost ~230,000 souls.

I remember the high Catholic mass when I was a kid (I was raised
Catholic). Much different now-a-days.

I much prefer the way the Ancient Church (Orthodox) does their
services. I have mainly only been able to watch it though.
I love Pascha (Easter) service where the priest sings out
"Christ is Risen!" and the choir blast back at him "Indeed
he is risen!" and then blast away (the priest lights the fuse).

In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...

:-)

-T

===============

Ahh memories:) I was raised catholic too and sang in the church choir until
my late teens. I haven't been to mass since them and I am told things are
very different:) I may be wrong but is it no longer in Latin?
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk
Bod
2016-12-30 10:22:05 UTC
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Post by T
Post by rbowman
Post by T
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly
Well, the Reformation wasn't a reformation, just an introduction of
theological novelties that ultimately fueled the Enlightenment.
Ultimately the Prods got what they deserved, a individualistic secular
society with the mainline protestant sects flat lining. Too bad the
Catholics chose to join the lemming leap after Vatican II. The last Mass
I went to, back in the '80s, might as well have been a Unitarian love feast.
Hi R,
It was unfortunate that the Reformation had to happen at all.
Had the Catholics not left the Church and remained true to
apostolic teaching and the Councils, the Reformation would have
never happened. And humanity would have not lost ~230,000 souls.
I remember the high Catholic mass when I was a kid (I was raised
Catholic). Much different now-a-days.
I much prefer the way the Ancient Church (Orthodox) does their
services. I have mainly only been able to watch it though.
I love Pascha (Easter) service where the priest sings out
"Christ is Risen!" and the choir blast back at him "Indeed
he is risen!" and then blast away (the priest lights the fuse).
In the Catholic services, it is very much like the Protestants.
The minister talks for a while, then gets a rest while the choir
sings. In the Ancient service, the choir blasts back and forth
with the priest. The folks is suppose to join in too,
but what would life be without the lecture ...
:-)
-T
===============
Ahh memories:) I was raised catholic too and sang in the church choir until
my late teens. I haven't been to mass since them and I am told things are
very different:) I may be wrong but is it no longer in Latin?
I too sang for a few years in a church choir, simply because I loved
singing. I didn't believe in god then and I still don't. Churches have a
nice atmosphere though.
I keep promising to go to midnight mass one day on Christmas day.
Maybe next year.

Muggles
2016-12-30 05:59:12 UTC
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Post by T
Post by rbowman
thing rankles; intercession of a saint goes against
the solas.
I find it bazaar that they pray for each other and get
scandalized if a saint is asked for their prayers.
I can't find any scripture that tells us to ask people who have
passed away to pray for us. Jesus is supposed to be our intercessor
when it comes to that side... I haven't come across scripture that
says the dead in Christ have access to the living, or vice versa.
--
Maggie
T
2016-12-30 08:15:27 UTC
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Post by T
Post by rbowman
thing rankles; intercession of a saint goes against
the solas.
I find it bazaar that they pray for each other and get
scandalized if a saint is asked for their prayers.
I can't find any scripture that tells us to ask people who have passed
away to pray for us. Jesus is supposed to be our intercessor when it
comes to that side... I haven't come across scripture that says the
dead in Christ have access to the living, or vice versa.
Hi Maggie,

Do you believe in the Trinity?

The word "Trinity" is a Latin word and there is not one single
word of Latin in the Bible. The Trinity came out of the
same Nicaean council that compiled the Bible and the Nicaean
Creed.

If you believe in the Trinity, then you are not
"sola scriptura" (the Bible Only). And you are trusting
the authority of the Ancient Church in its teachings.
Just as you are trusting their authority over what went
in the Bible.

Not everything Christians believe is in the Bible. This
one is though.

We Ancient Faith'ers have a long history of the asking
others for their prayers, whether they are in Heaven
or on Earth. The first time a saint prays for you, you
can never be dissuaded of their existence. Those in
heaven have a lot of access to us. As beloved Saint
Paul says, "love never ends" (1 Corinthians 13).

I personally have had several Saints pray for me. And
I have a personal relationship with one who chose me.
He has even spoken to me in English before. It gets
really interesting when Jesus joins the conversation.

And no saint is more approachable than Jesus. My
personal belief is that the Lord loves it when we
pray for others, not just ourselves.

Also notice I said "we". The Church Triumphant in
heaven and the Church Militant on Earth. "We".
We are not abandoned and forgotten by the Church
Triumphant.

Our communion in prayer with the saints is the
realization of the bond between Christians on
earth and the Heavenly Church. (Heb 12:22-23)

Asking a saint for their prayers is no different than
me asking you for your prayers. And, of course, it
is whatever you feel comfortable with.

Love never ends.

Yours in Christ,
--Todd

And another angel came, and stood before the altar,
having a golden censer; and there was given to him
much incense, that he should offer of the prayers
of all saints upon the golden altar, which is before
the throne of God. And the smoke of the incense of
the prayers of the saints ascended up before God
from the hand of the angel. (Rev 8: 3-4)
Bod
2016-12-30 10:13:33 UTC
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Post by T
Post by rbowman
Many have no desire to know what Catholics really believe.
It is sad that it seems to be a tenant of their faith
what others believe. Ask them? Not a chance!
Post by rbowman
In fact, the
Klan figured a Catholic would do if they couldn't find a handy negro.
Hold over hatred from the reformation. The Catholics handled
the Reformation really badly.
Post by rbowman
I have personal theological issues but the Catholic Church did a pretty
good job of adapting to the soul of the northern Europeans when they
displaced the old Gods.
'Poll suggests more Anglicans don’t believe in God than take their
faith seriously'

https://godandpoliticsuk.org/2013/05/03/poll-suggests-more-anglicans-dont-believe-in-god-than-fear-him/
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