Discussion:
Conducting concrete
(too old to reply)
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 17:58:12 UTC
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Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!

Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
--
A man goes home early and catches another man in bed with his wife.
He drags the naked man out of the house and into his garden shed.
There he secures man's penis in a vice and removes the handle, then starts to sharpen a knife.
The naked man shouts, "You're not going to cut it off are you?"
"No, you are," was the reply. "I'm going to set fire to the shed"
The Peeler
2017-01-04 18:02:57 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based
house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Even sorrier that it isn't possible for you to just shut your stupid gob!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic world:
"I was once told off for killing a mouse too slowly."
MID: <***@red.lan>
One message later:
"I left mine to starve."
MID: <***@red.lan>
trader_4
2017-01-04 18:31:06 UTC
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Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Stormin' Norman
2017-01-04 18:35:15 UTC
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On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 10:31:06 -0800 (PST), trader_4
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Ah yes, the old Ufer ground. That protected a lot of ordinance
throughout the years.
Oren
2017-01-04 19:05:00 UTC
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On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 10:31:06 -0800 (PST), trader_4
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Best I can tell, my foundation has an Ufer ground. Inside the
exterior wall there is a ground rod going down into the concrete.
Might be tied into the cable tension cables in the foundation. This
is in the desert.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 20:02:30 UTC
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Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
--
I don't have OCD - I'm just defragmenting the universe.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 20:43:46 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:02:30 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
Bullshit! You know what rebar means at all, Birdbrain?
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange sociopathic
world:
"Boat fell over, the weakest died, Darwin wins, end of story."
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-04 22:12:42 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:02:30 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
This was originally designed for ammo dumps in the desert so try
again. Where you live, it is always wet isn't it?
The effectiveness is in the contact area, not any single point.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 22:17:02 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:02:30 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
This was originally designed for ammo dumps in the desert so try
again.
First time I've seen ammo dumps mentioned. We're talking about houses, concrete floors, and the dangers of being earthed.
Post by g***@aol.com
Where you live, it is always wet isn't it?
Yes, but not inside the house.
Post by g***@aol.com
The effectiveness is in the contact area, not any single point.
The top surface of the concrete in the house isn't wet. If it is, your carpet would go mouldy.
--
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The average number of items in the typical woman's bathroom is 337. A man would not be able to identify more than 20 of these items.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 22:49:13 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:17:02 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Where you live, it is always wet isn't it?
Yes, but not inside the house.
You are obviously wet behind the ears, Birdbrain!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"Why is the soup talking to itself?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 00:01:52 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:17:02 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:02:30 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
This was originally designed for ammo dumps in the desert so try
again.
First time I've seen ammo dumps mentioned. We're talking about houses, concrete floors, and the dangers of being earthed.
The danger is not being earthed when you are talking about ammo and
this was the most effective way to earth them.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Where you live, it is always wet isn't it?
Yes, but not inside the house.
Post by g***@aol.com
The effectiveness is in the contact area, not any single point.
The top surface of the concrete in the house isn't wet. If it is, your carpet would go mouldy.
It is wet enough to ionize the stuff in concrete.
I didn't make this shit up on the spot, google Ufer.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 00:12:35 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:17:02 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:02:30 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Wrong as usual. Concrete that's been cured and then dried out,
kept away from moisture, may not be a good conductor. But building
concrete, a foundation is such a good conductor, it's the preferred
ground for the building electrical service. An electrode is placed
inside it before the pour.
Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot.
This was originally designed for ammo dumps in the desert so try
again.
First time I've seen ammo dumps mentioned. We're talking about houses, concrete floors, and the dangers of being earthed.
The danger is not being earthed when you are talking about ammo and
this was the most effective way to earth them.
Perhaps, if the concrete is guaranteed to be wet, but then the ammo would get damp.

But I wasn't talking about ammo.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Where you live, it is always wet isn't it?
Yes, but not inside the house.
Post by g***@aol.com
The effectiveness is in the contact area, not any single point.
The top surface of the concrete in the house isn't wet. If it is, your carpet would go mouldy.
It is wet enough to ionize the stuff in concrete.
I didn't make this shit up on the spot, google Ufer.
It simply isn't true, I tested it.
--
Someday we'll look back on all this and plough into a parked car.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 00:21:55 UTC
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On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:12:35 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Yes, but not inside the house.
Post by g***@aol.com
The effectiveness is in the contact area, not any single point.
The top surface of the concrete in the house isn't wet. If it is, your carpet would go mouldy.
It is wet enough to ionize the stuff in concrete.
I didn't make this shit up on the spot, google Ufer.
It simply isn't true, I tested it.
Yeah, but you are a known IDIOT, Birdbrain!
--
More from Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange "mind":
"Anyone without Hoplophobia is a mass murderer."
Message-ID: <***@red.lan>
mike
2017-01-04 18:42:34 UTC
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Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based
house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with PEX.
That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.

I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
burfordTjustice
2017-01-04 18:48:40 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
plus he is the local dole whore loon.
mike
2017-01-04 19:13:21 UTC
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Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
Post by burfordTjustice
plus he is the local dole whore loon.
Count up YOUR posts and try to say that again with a straight face.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 20:00:22 UTC
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Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
--
The average lifespan of electronic devices is between zero and infinity, or 2 days after the warranty runs out, whichever comes first.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 20:46:24 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of
your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone
recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I
wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Birdbrain, YOU are OFF THE WALL!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"A cucumber looks and smells nothing like a snake."
MID: <***@red.lan>
burfordTjustice
2017-01-04 21:02:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass
inspection. Long story short, research indicated that using rebar
in concrete was a trend in establishing a safety ground.
Apparently, there's enough conductive salt and water in concrete
to make it work, as long as the concrete sits on the ground and
you're not in the desert. Contact resistance is high, but
there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that
the "grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to
make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
LOL Please post a picture of you taking the measurement.
burfordTjustice
2017-01-05 12:44:43 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 4 Jan 2017 16:02:42 -0500
Post by The Peeler
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a
concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a
bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main
with PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass
inspection. Long story short, research indicated that using
rebar in concrete was a trend in establishing a safety ground.
Apparently, there's enough conductive salt and water in concrete
to make it work, as long as the concrete sits on the ground and
you're not in the desert. Contact resistance is high, but
there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that
the "grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in
the UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
LOL Please post a picture of you taking the measurement.
Well?
g***@aol.com
2017-01-04 21:11:26 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 21:22:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No electricity worth considering is passing at all.
--
A military pilot called for a priority landing because his single-engine jet fighter was running "a bit peaked."
Air Traffic Control told the fighter jock that he was number two, behind a B-52 that had one engine shut down.
"Ah," the fighter pilot remarked, "The dreaded seven-engine approach."
The Peeler
2017-01-04 21:51:05 UTC
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Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
You made it all up. If not, post pic, sociopath!
--
More from Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange "mind":
"Anyone without Hoplophobia is a mass murderer."
Message-ID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-04 22:16:19 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.

Don't tell me you are one of those scotsmen who wear panties.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 22:22:46 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
Post by g***@aol.com
Don't tell me you are one of those scotsmen who wear panties.
I go commando.
--
I just took a leaflet out of my mailbox, informing me that I can have sex at 75.
I'm so happy, because I live at number 71.
So it's not too far to walk home afterwards. And it's the same side of the street.
I don't even have to cross the road!
The Peeler
2017-01-04 22:50:21 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:46 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Don't tell me you are one of those scotsmen who wear panties.
I go commando.
Yes, ANYTHING to attract attention, eh, Birdbrain? <VBG>
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic world:
"Most animals don't attack me, even though their owners tell me they're
dangerous. I had to laugh at one woman who ran out to tell me her dog was
going to bite my hand off, then saw me petting it. I once bought a parrot
that was extremely vicious. I walked into his house and picked it up, then
cuddled it. He said he'd never seen it do that in 10 years."
MID: <***@red.lan>
FromTheRafters
2017-01-04 22:56:57 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of
your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone
recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure
I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 23:31:13 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of
your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone
recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure
I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
So as I said before, it's the water conducting. But your floor really really shouldn't be damp.
--
A "Frisbeterian" believes that when you die, your soul goes up on the roof and you can't get it back down.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 23:58:37 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 23:31:13 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
So as I said before, it's the water conducting. But your floor really
really shouldn't be damp.
You still don't get it, stupid! <tsk>
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's from (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep thinking:
"Prisoners of war is a stupid idea. Just kill them. Why save the enemy?
You're working for the wrong side!"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 00:16:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 23:31:13 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of
your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone
recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure
I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
So as I said before, it's the water conducting. But your floor really really shouldn't be damp.
The Ufer ground is not in the floor, it is in the foundation but your
concrete floor still has enough conductivity to get you a nasty shock
if you have sufficient contact.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 00:34:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 23:31:13 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of
your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone
recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure
I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No
electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
So as I said before, it's the water conducting. But your floor really really shouldn't be damp.
The Ufer ground is not in the floor, it is in the foundation but your
concrete floor still has enough conductivity to get you a nasty shock
if you have sufficient contact.
20 MOhms prevents shock.
--
Why do they rate a movie "R" for "adult language?"
The only people I hear using that language are teenagers.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 00:45:59 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:34:02 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by FromTheRafters
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~concrete/students/farshad/MS-Chapter%203.pdf
So as I said before, it's the water conducting. But your floor really really shouldn't be damp.
The Ufer ground is not in the floor, it is in the foundation but your
concrete floor still has enough conductivity to get you a nasty shock
if you have sufficient contact.
20 MOhms prevents shock.
Obviously at some point in your miserable life some awful shock to your
brain happened, Birdbrain!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange sociopathic
world:
"Boat fell over, the weakest died, Darwin wins, end of story."
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 00:12:46 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:46 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
Try it and get back to me. That is 20meg at one small point. If you
can find 2 pieces of rebar with 20' in contact with the concrete,
check that to ground or another rebar in the same slab.

"Earth" is a pretty bad conductor in the first place so what you are
really trying to create is an equipotential ground grid.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Don't tell me you are one of those scotsmen who wear panties.
I go commando.
Cool, especially when the wind is blowing in off the North Sea in
January. ;-)
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 00:30:35 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:46 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:22:56 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:00:22 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
Question wasn't about rules.
Was about concrete as a ground. Unlikely it's much different in the
UK.
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale (>20MOhms)
Across what surface area?
Why don't you sit on the concrete floor barr assed and grab a hot
wire. Have your widow get back to us.
1cm from electrode to electrode = >20MOhms. That's an INSULATOR. No electricity worth considering is passing at all.
Then it should be safe, pull up your kilt, plop down on a concrete
floor and grab that wire.
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
Try it and get back to me. That is 20meg at one small point. If you
can find 2 pieces of rebar with 20' in contact with the concrete,
check that to ground or another rebar in the same slab.
Rebar isn't common here, anyway you have to conduct the electricity down to the metal.
Post by g***@aol.com
"Earth" is a pretty bad conductor in the first place so what you are
really trying to create is an equipotential ground grid.
No it isn't. Earth tends to be damp.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Don't tell me you are one of those scotsmen who wear panties.
I go commando.
Cool, especially when the wind is blowing in off the North Sea in
January. ;-)
Especially then. I run naked along the beach, which causes amusement.
--
Peter is listening to Psy - Gangnam style
The Peeler
2017-01-05 00:47:09 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:30:35 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
What part of 20MOhms didn't you understand?
Try it and get back to me. That is 20meg at one small point. If you
can find 2 pieces of rebar with 20' in contact with the concrete,
check that to ground or another rebar in the same slab.
Rebar isn't common here, anyway you have to conduct the electricity down to the metal.
Rebar is common EVERYWHERE, you lying bitch!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"Why is the soup talking to itself?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
Dean Hoffman
2017-01-05 00:14:36 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
This is from the meter maker Fluke:
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 00:32:49 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20 MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
--
The longest word in German is DONAUDAMPFSCHIFFAHRTSELEKTRIZITAETENHAUPTBETRIEBSWERKBAUUNTERBEAMTENGESELLSCHAFT, "the club for subordinate officials of the head office management of the Danube steamboat electrical services" (name of a pre-war club in Vienna), according to 1996 Guinness.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 00:48:34 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:32:49 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
See above, idiot!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"A cucumber looks and smells nothing like a snake."
MID: <***@red.lan>
Dean Hoffman
2017-01-05 01:13:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On 1/4/17 6:32 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 01:24:08 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
--
"VAT is a simple tax..." -- Anthony Barber, Chancellor of the Exchequer on the introduction of VAT on April Fool's Day in 1973.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 01:35:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:24:08 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts.
Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The
floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems,
way above a possibility of shock.
So, are you claiming that you are smarter than the guys who DID have the
proper knowledge and tools to conduct their research, you fucked up
sociopathic idiot? LOL
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"I don't wear underwear, but boxers are more comfortable than briefs. Why
would you want it clamped in?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 01:37:51 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:24:08 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
Stop the presses, some naked scotsman has debunked 100 years of
electrical science. Your Nobel prize is in the mail sir.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 01:44:47 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:24:08 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
Stop the presses, some naked scotsman has debunked 100 years of
electrical science. Your Nobel prize is in the mail sir.
I'm using common sense. You're completely misinterpreting what you read on the internet.
--
Why is bra singular and panties plural?
The Peeler
2017-01-05 01:49:25 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:44:47 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
Stop the presses, some naked scotsman has debunked 100 years of
electrical science. Your Nobel prize is in the mail sir.
I'm using common sense. You're completely misinterpreting what you read on the internet.
You are a sick asshole and troll! Period!
--
Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic "mind" at work:
"Satan is god's wife. Woman are evil."
MID: <***@red.lan>
c***@snyder.on.ca
2017-01-05 04:56:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:24:08 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
Stop the presses, some naked scotsman has debunked 100 years of
electrical science. Your Nobel prize is in the mail sir.
Concrete without water in it isn't concrete. The lime in portland
cement is hydrated. Don'rt believe me? What happens if you heat
concrete quickly? It explodes from the steam poressure created by the
entrained moisture in the concrete - the hydration. That's what
refractory cement is made for, and the reason it exists.

from a concrete information site :

When water is added to cement, each of the compounds undergoes
hydration and contributes to the final concrete product. Only the
calcium silicates contribute to strength. Tricalcium silicate is
responsible for most of the early strength (first 7 days). Dicalcium
silicate, which reacts more slowly, contributes only to the strength
at later times. Tricalcium silicate will be discussed in the greatest
detail.

The equation for the hydration of tricalcium silicate is given by:

Tricalcium silicate + Water--->Calcium silicate hydrate+Calcium
hydroxide + heat

2 Ca3SiO5 + 7 H2O ---> 3 CaO.2SiO2.4H2O + 3 Ca(OH)2 + 173.6kJ

Upon the addition of water, tricalcium silicate rapidly reacts to
release calcium ions, hydroxide ions, and a large amount of heat. The
pH quickly rises to over 12 because of the release of alkaline
hydroxide (OH-) ions. This initial hydrolysis slows down quickly after
it starts resulting in a decrease in heat evolved.

The reaction slowly continues producing calcium and hydroxide ions
until the system becomes saturated. Once this occurs, the calcium
hydroxide starts to crystallize. Simultaneously, calcium silicate
hydrate begins to form. Ions precipitate out of solution accelerating
the reaction of tricalcium silicate to calcium and hydroxide ions. (Le
Chatlier's principle). The evolution of heat is then dramatically
increased.

The formation of the calcium hydroxide and calcium silicate hydrate
crystals provide "seeds" upon which more calcium silicate hydrate can
form. The calcium silicate hydrate crystals grow thicker making it
more difficult for water molecules to reach the unhydrated tricalcium
silicate. The speed of the reaction is now controlled by the rate at
which water molecules diffuse through the calcium silicate hydrate
coating. This coating thickens over time causing the production of
calcium silicate hydrate to become slower and slower.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 19:41:35 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by c***@snyder.on.ca
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:24:08 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
Stop the presses, some naked scotsman has debunked 100 years of
electrical science. Your Nobel prize is in the mail sir.
Concrete without water in it isn't concrete. The lime in portland
cement is hydrated. Don'rt believe me? What happens if you heat
concrete quickly? It explodes from the steam poressure created by the
entrained moisture in the concrete - the hydration. That's what
refractory cement is made for, and the reason it exists.
When water is added to cement, each of the compounds undergoes
hydration and contributes to the final concrete product. Only the
calcium silicates contribute to strength. Tricalcium silicate is
responsible for most of the early strength (first 7 days). Dicalcium
silicate, which reacts more slowly, contributes only to the strength
at later times. Tricalcium silicate will be discussed in the greatest
detail.
Tricalcium silicate + Water--->Calcium silicate hydrate+Calcium
hydroxide + heat
2 Ca3SiO5 + 7 H2O ---> 3 CaO.2SiO2.4H2O + 3 Ca(OH)2 + 173.6kJ
Upon the addition of water, tricalcium silicate rapidly reacts to
release calcium ions, hydroxide ions, and a large amount of heat. The
pH quickly rises to over 12 because of the release of alkaline
hydroxide (OH-) ions. This initial hydrolysis slows down quickly after
it starts resulting in a decrease in heat evolved.
The reaction slowly continues producing calcium and hydroxide ions
until the system becomes saturated. Once this occurs, the calcium
hydroxide starts to crystallize. Simultaneously, calcium silicate
hydrate begins to form. Ions precipitate out of solution accelerating
the reaction of tricalcium silicate to calcium and hydroxide ions. (Le
Chatlier's principle). The evolution of heat is then dramatically
increased.
The formation of the calcium hydroxide and calcium silicate hydrate
crystals provide "seeds" upon which more calcium silicate hydrate can
form. The calcium silicate hydrate crystals grow thicker making it
more difficult for water molecules to reach the unhydrated tricalcium
silicate. The speed of the reaction is now controlled by the rate at
which water molecules diffuse through the calcium silicate hydrate
coating. This coating thickens over time causing the production of
calcium silicate hydrate to become slower and slower.
Funny how it doesn't conduct then. Show me a video of dry concrete conducting electricity.
--
What do lawyers and sperm have in common?
1 in 50 million has a chance of becoming a human being.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 20:08:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 19:41:35 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by c***@snyder.on.ca
The formation of the calcium hydroxide and calcium silicate hydrate
crystals provide "seeds" upon which more calcium silicate hydrate can
form. The calcium silicate hydrate crystals grow thicker making it
more difficult for water molecules to reach the unhydrated tricalcium
silicate. The speed of the reaction is now controlled by the rate at
which water molecules diffuse through the calcium silicate hydrate
coating. This coating thickens over time causing the production of
calcium silicate hydrate to become slower and slower.
Funny how it doesn't conduct then. Show me a video of dry concrete conducting electricity.
Read the pdf article that someone provided for you the other day, you
abysmally stupid twit!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"If the human is inferior to the dog, we don't care for the dead human."
MID: <***@red.lan>
F Murtz
2017-01-05 08:04:42 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts.
Not that well, it is whatever salts and impurities in it that do.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The
floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG
problems, way above a possibility of shock.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 19:43:29 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by F Murtz
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts.
Not that well, it is whatever salts and impurities in it that do.
I never said pure water :-)
--
Statistics show that 25% of all women are on medication for mental illness.
That's scary! It means 75% are running around with no bloody medication at all!!!
The Peeler
2017-01-05 20:10:45 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 19:43:29 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by F Murtz
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts.
Not that well, it is whatever salts and impurities in it that do.
I never said pure water :-)
Evasion of Ufer's and other people's findings noted, you fucked up
disgusting troll!
--
More from Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange "mind":
"Anyone without Hoplophobia is a mass murderer."
Message-ID: <***@red.lan>
Chris Green
2017-01-05 10:14:05 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete
Not really (water that is), pure water is a very poor conductor. It's the
impurities in water that make it a reasonable coductor but even tap
water isn't that good.
--
Chris Green
·
F Murtz
2017-01-05 11:20:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Chris Green
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete
Not really (water that is), pure water is a very poor conductor. It's the
impurities in water that make it a reasonable coductor but even tap
water isn't that good.
Is there an echo in here?
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 20:10:39 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Chris Green
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete
Not really (water that is), pure water is a very poor conductor. It's the
impurities in water that make it a reasonable coductor but even tap
water isn't that good.
It's very good. Which is why people get shock in swimming pools and baths.
--
A dyslexic man walks into a bra.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 20:18:03 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 20:10:39 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Chris Green
Not really (water that is), pure water is a very poor conductor. It's the
impurities in water that make it a reasonable coductor but even tap
water isn't that good.
It's very good. Which is why people get shock in swimming pools and baths.
People get shock in swimming pools and baths, Birdbrain? <BG> Do tell us
everything about it!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"A cucumber looks and smells nothing like a snake."
MID: <***@red.lan>
trader_4
2017-01-05 14:37:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
--
"VAT is a simple tax..." -- Anthony Barber, Chancellor of the Exchequer on the introduction of VAT on April Fool's Day in 1973.
http://www.esgroundingsolutions.com/different-types-of-grounding-electrodes/

Ufer Ground or Concrete Encased Electrodes

Originally, Ufer grounds were copper electrodes encased in the concrete surrounding ammunition bunkers. In today’s terminology, Ufer grounds consist of any concrete-encased electrode, such as the rebar in a building foundation, when used for grounding, or a wire or wire mesh in concrete.

Concrete Encased Electrode

The National Electric Code requires that Concrete Encased Electrodes use a minimum No. 4 AWG copper wire at least 20 feet in length and encased in at least 2 inches of concrete. The advantages of concrete encased electrodes are that they dramatically increase the surface area and degree of contact with the surrounding soil. However, the zone of influence is not increased, therefore the resistance to ground is typically only slightly lower than the wire would be without the concrete.

Concrete encased electrodes also have some significant disadvantages. When an electrical fault occurs, the electric current must flow through the concrete into the earth. Concrete, by nature retains a lot of water, which rises in temperature as the electricity flows through the concrete. If the extent of the electrode is not sufficiently great for the total current flowing, the boiling point of the water may be reached, resulting in an explosive conversion of water into steam. Many concrete encased electrodes have been destroyed after receiving relatively small electrical faults. Once the concrete cracks apart and falls away from the conductor, the concrete pieces act as a shield preventing the copper wire from contacting the surrounding soil, resulting in a dramatic increase in the resistance-to-ground of the electrode.

Ufer Ground or Building Foundations

Ufer Grounds or building foundations may be used provided that the concrete is in direct contact with the earth (no plastic moisture barriers), that rebar is at least 0.500 inches in diameter and that there is a direct metallic connection from the service ground to the rebar buried inside the concrete.



If you bothered to look at your own country's codes, you'd see
that Ufers are one of the allowed types of grounding in the UK.

https://books.google.com/books?id=-120XiXXOCoC&pg=SL3-PA133&lpg=SL3-PA133&dq=earthing+electrode++542-02-01&source=bl&ots=kD-d0hdo4A&sig=cF6fUcCSksgbN1uRBTtI6EabUqA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwik_7vlm6vRAhXs7IMKHSMDCqkQ6AEILjAE#v=onepage&q=earthing%20electrode%20%20542-02-01&f=false

"Handbook of the Wiring Regulations" (UK)
Based on BS 7671 2001 edition

It's page C2/15, they show 7 types of allowed earth grounds,
two of the 7 are metal electrodes embedded in concrete.

But then you say codes don't matter and you've demonstrated
that you're one of the village idiot trolls, so I'm sure
that won't change anything either.
DerbyDad03
2017-01-05 15:01:40 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by trader_4
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
You guess?
Post by Dean Hoffman
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got >20
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter? It
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him.
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's grounding
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. The floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG problems, way above a possibility of shock.
--
"VAT is a simple tax..." -- Anthony Barber, Chancellor of the Exchequer on the introduction of VAT on April Fool's Day in 1973.
http://www.esgroundingsolutions.com/different-types-of-grounding-electrodes/
Ufer Ground or Concrete Encased Electrodes
Originally, Ufer grounds were copper electrodes encased in the concrete surrounding ammunition bunkers. In today’s terminology, Ufer grounds consist of any concrete-encased electrode, such as the rebar in a building foundation, when used for grounding, or a wire or wire mesh in concrete.
Concrete Encased Electrode
The National Electric Code requires that Concrete Encased Electrodes use a minimum No. 4 AWG copper wire at least 20 feet in length and encased in at least 2 inches of concrete. The advantages of concrete encased electrodes are that they dramatically increase the surface area and degree of contact with the surrounding soil. However, the zone of influence is not increased, therefore the resistance to ground is typically only slightly lower than the wire would be without the concrete.
Concrete encased electrodes also have some significant disadvantages. When an electrical fault occurs, the electric current must flow through the concrete into the earth. Concrete, by nature retains a lot of water, which rises in temperature as the electricity flows through the concrete. If the extent of the electrode is not sufficiently great for the total current flowing, the boiling point of the water may be reached, resulting in an explosive conversion of water into steam. Many concrete encased electrodes have been destroyed after receiving relatively small electrical faults. Once the concrete cracks apart and falls away from the conductor, the concrete pieces act as a shield preventing the copper wire from contacting the surrounding soil, resulting in a dramatic increase in the resistance-to-ground of the electrode.
Ufer Ground or Building Foundations
Ufer Grounds or building foundations may be used provided that the concrete is in direct contact with the earth (no plastic moisture barriers), that rebar is at least 0.500 inches in diameter and that there is a direct metallic connection from the service ground to the rebar buried inside the concrete.
If you bothered to look at your own country's codes, you'd see
that Ufers are one of the allowed types of grounding in the UK.
https://books.google.com/books?id=-120XiXXOCoC&pg=SL3-PA133&lpg=SL3-PA133&dq=earthing+electrode++542-02-01&source=bl&ots=kD-d0hdo4A&sig=cF6fUcCSksgbN1uRBTtI6EabUqA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwik_7vlm6vRAhXs7IMKHSMDCqkQ6AEILjAE#v=onepage&q=earthing%20electrode%20%20542-02-01&f=false
"Handbook of the Wiring Regulations" (UK)
Based on BS 7671 2001 edition
It's page C2/15, they show 7 types of allowed earth grounds,
two of the 7 are metal electrodes embedded in concrete.
But then you say codes don't matter and you've demonstrated
that you're one of the village idiot trolls, so I'm sure
that won't change anything either.
It's not just that he believes that "codes" don't apply to the owner of
the building, there is another problem with your explanation:

"Concrete, by nature retains a lot of water..."

The only time the water in concrete is an issue is if it rains a lot. Go
ahead, ask him. ;-)

"Only if the concrete stays wet. Which won't happen unless it rains a lot."

See? He said it. It must be true.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 21:02:28 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 8:24:20 PM UTC-5, James Wilkinson Swo=
Post by Dean Hoffman
Some cut.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular oh=
m meter.
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
You guess?
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once =
if
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram sh=
owing
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor h=
ad a
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no=
way
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_=
ENG_A_W.PDF>
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
"A good grounding resistance is 5 ohms or less" - well since I got=
20
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
MOhms, I guess that isn't grounded.
So did you use an actual ground tester or a volt/ohm meter=
? It
Post by Dean Hoffman
sure seems odd that
your results don't match Mr. Ufer's and bunches of people after him=
.
Post by Dean Hoffman
An article in Electrical Contractor magazine says Ufer's groundi=
ng
Post by Dean Hoffman
electrodes kept the resistance at 2-5 ohms over a 20 year period.
<> http://www.ecmag.com/section/codes-standards/what-ufer-ground>
Resistance is resistance. Concrete does NOT conduct. WATER conducts=
. Concrete is a porous material which may or may not contain water. Th=
e floor of your house should never contain water, or you have BIG proble=
ms, way above a possibility of shock.
--
"VAT is a simple tax..." -- Anthony Barber, Chancellor of the Exchequ=
er on the introduction of VAT on April Fool's Day in 1973.
http://www.esgroundingsolutions.com/different-types-of-grounding-elect=
rodes/
Ufer Ground or Concrete Encased Electrodes
Originally, Ufer grounds were copper electrodes encased in the concret=
e surrounding ammunition bunkers. In today=E2=80=99s terminology, Ufer g=
rounds consist of any concrete-encased electrode, such as the rebar in a=
building foundation, when used for grounding, or a wire or wire mesh in=
concrete.
Concrete Encased Electrode
The National Electric Code requires that Concrete Encased Electrodes u=
se a minimum No. 4 AWG copper wire at least 20 feet in length and encase=
d in at least 2 inches of concrete. The advantages of concrete encased e=
lectrodes are that they dramatically increase the surface area and degre=
e of contact with the surrounding soil. However, the zone of influence i=
s not increased, therefore the resistance to ground is typically only sl=
ightly lower than the wire would be without the concrete.
Concrete encased electrodes also have some significant disadvantages. =
When an electrical fault occurs, the electric current must flow through =
the concrete into the earth. Concrete, by nature retains a lot of water,=
which rises in temperature as the electricity flows through the concret=
e. If the extent of the electrode is not sufficiently great for the tota=
l current flowing, the boiling point of the water may be reached, result=
ing in an explosive conversion of water into steam. Many concrete encase=
d electrodes have been destroyed after receiving relatively small electr=
ical faults. Once the concrete cracks apart and falls away from the cond=
uctor, the concrete pieces act as a shield preventing the copper wire fr=
om contacting the surrounding soil, resulting in a dramatic increase in =
the resistance-to-ground of the electrode.
Ufer Ground or Building Foundations
Ufer Grounds or building foundations may be used provided that the con=
crete is in direct contact with the earth (no plastic moisture barriers)=
, that rebar is at least 0.500 inches in diameter and that there is a di=
rect metallic connection from the service ground to the rebar buried ins=
ide the concrete.
If you bothered to look at your own country's codes, you'd see
that Ufers are one of the allowed types of grounding in the UK.
https://books.google.com/books?id=3D-120XiXXOCoC&pg=3DSL3-PA133&lpg=3D=
SL3-PA133&dq=3Dearthing+electrode++542-02-01&source=3Dbl&ots=3DkD-d0hdo4=
A&sig=3DcF6fUcCSksgbN1uRBTtI6EabUqA&hl=3Den&sa=3DX&ved=3D0ahUKEwik_7vlm6=
vRAhXs7IMKHSMDCqkQ6AEILjAE#v=3Donepage&q=3Dearthing%20electrode%20%20542=
-02-01&f=3Dfalse
"Handbook of the Wiring Regulations" (UK)
Based on BS 7671 2001 edition
It's page C2/15, they show 7 types of allowed earth grounds,
two of the 7 are metal electrodes embedded in concrete.
But then you say codes don't matter and you've demonstrated
that you're one of the village idiot trolls, so I'm sure
that won't change anything either.
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?

-- =

I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not
what I meant.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 21:18:02 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:02:28 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
But then you say codes don't matter and you've demonstrated
that you're one of the village idiot trolls, so I'm sure
that won't change anything either.
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?
"But then you say codes don't matter and you've demonstrated that you're one
of the village idiot trolls, so I'm sure that won't change anything
either."

Spot on!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"If the human is inferior to the dog, we don't care for the dead human."
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 21:20:58 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:02:28 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?
The 20 feet is horizontal.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-06 01:27:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:02:28 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?
The 20 feet is horizontal.
If it's not below the water table, no conduction.
--
Snap-off parts, because it's French.
FromTheRafters
2017-01-06 01:36:40 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:02:28 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?
The 20 feet is horizontal.
If it's not below the water table, no conduction.
All materials conduct, some better than others.
m***@yahoo.com
2017-01-06 14:29:12 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
If you touch a hot 120 V wire while standing in socks on your concrete basement
floor or on a deck outside, you WILL get a shock.


It's up to you if you want to call that __conducting__ or not.



m
TimR
2017-01-06 15:56:08 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by m***@yahoo.com
If you touch a hot 120 V wire while standing in socks on your concrete basement
floor or on a deck outside, you WILL get a shock.
It's up to you if you want to call that __conducting__ or not.
m
I found a reply from OSHA to a question from a corporate safety officer:

Question 2: Would you consider an ungrounded fan, on a dry concrete floor, on grade, in an industrial setting a violation of this specific standard?

Reply: The use of an ungrounded fan situated on a dry concrete floor on grade in an industrial setting will be a violation of the OSHA rule at 1910.304(f)(5)(v)(C)(5), if the fan has exposed non-current-carrying metal parts that can be contacted by employees. Concrete on grade level, because it will absorb moisture from the earth and be a good conductor in direct contact with the earth, is always considered to be at ground potential.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-07 15:28:09 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by TimR
Post by m***@yahoo.com
If you touch a hot 120 V wire while standing in socks on your concrete basement
floor or on a deck outside, you WILL get a shock.
It's up to you if you want to call that __conducting__ or not.
m
Question 2: Would you consider an ungrounded fan, on a dry concrete floor, on grade, in an industrial setting a violation of this specific standard?
Reply: The use of an ungrounded fan situated on a dry concrete floor on grade in an industrial setting will be a violation of the OSHA rule at 1910.304(f)(5)(v)(C)(5), if the fan has exposed non-current-carrying metal parts that can be contacted by employees. Concrete on grade level, because it will absorb moisture from the earth and be a good conductor in direct contact with the earth, is always considered to be at ground potential.
There's something very important right there which backs me up completely:

"because it will absorb moisture from the earth and be a good conductor in direct contact with the earth". So **damp** concrete conducts. I wasn't talking about damp concrete. I was talking about concrete dry enough to be the floor of your home. Do you really walk around on damp floors? What if you lay a carpet?
--
Peter is in the top three most intelligent people -- Ron Tompkins, circa 2013.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-07 15:26:09 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by m***@yahoo.com
If you touch a hot 120 V wire while standing in socks on your concrete basement
floor or on a deck outside, you WILL get a shock.
It's up to you if you want to call that __conducting__ or not.
You don't get enough current through a >20MOhm resistance to give you even a tingle.
--
Steve Ryder covering the US Masters: "Ballesteros felt much better today after a 69 yesterday."
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-07 15:26:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by FromTheRafters
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:02:28 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
20 feet deep. How deep is the concrete in your floor? 6 inches?
The 20 feet is horizontal.
If it's not below the water table, no conduction.
All materials conduct, some better than others.
And in this case it's so insignificant it's nothing. Lightning might go through it....
--
Peter is listening to "Hollywood Undead - Turn Out The Lights"
The Peeler
2017-01-06 11:31:21 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Fri, 06 Jan 2017 01:27:33 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
The 20 feet is horizontal.
If it's not below the water table, no conduction.
Man, are you THICK! <tsk>
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"I don't wear underwear, but boxers are more comfortable than briefs. Why
would you want it clamped in?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
F Murtz
2017-01-05 08:09:46 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
My house is on a slab and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am
in the shower.
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth, which they are supposed to do now.
trader_4
2017-01-05 15:06:00 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by F Murtz
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
My house is on a slab and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am
in the shower.
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth, which they are supposed to do now.
There is something wrong with the bonding and/or grounding, and it
shouldn't be hard to identify and correct. I'd get it fixed before
something bad happens.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 21:14:52 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by trader_4
Post by F Murtz
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
My house is on a slab and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am
in the shower.
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth, which they are supposed to do now.
There is something wrong with the bonding and/or grounding, and it
shouldn't be hard to identify and correct. I'd get it fixed before
something bad happens.
Yes, 5V can be very very nasty....
--
Beating your wife is like keying your own car.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 21:35:41 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 21:14:52 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by trader_4
Post by F Murtz
My house is on a slab and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am
in the shower.
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth, which they are supposed to do now.
There is something wrong with the bonding and/or grounding, and it
shouldn't be hard to identify and correct. I'd get it fixed before
something bad happens.
Yes, 5V can be very very nasty....
Not as nasty as your disgusting trolling, PHucker!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"Why is the soup talking to itself?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 15:48:33 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by F Murtz
My house is on a slab and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am
in the shower.
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth, which they are supposed to do now.
Check, or have an electrician your grounding electrode system. Also be
sure metal piping is bonded around any plastic sections, water
softener and the water heater.
TimR
2017-01-05 17:57:23 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Two separate ideas being debated here.

1. Ufer grounding as an appropriate or legal method of grounding your system.

2. Concrete floors considered to be at ground potential.

For the latter, I have always been told that you must consider a concrete floor to be at ground, and therefore refrain from touching any hot wires.

I have not attempted to measure that myself and don't know the source of the claim. But I've seen it in a number of electrical safety classes, so if it is an urban legend it is a well distributed one.
trader_4
2017-01-06 15:00:04 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by TimR
Two separate ideas being debated here.
1. Ufer grounding as an appropriate or legal method of grounding your system.
2. Concrete floors considered to be at ground potential.
For the latter, I have always been told that you must consider a concrete floor to be at ground, and therefore refrain from touching any hot wires.
I have not attempted to measure that myself and don't know the source of the claim. But I've seen it in a number of electrical safety classes, so if it is an urban legend it is a well distributed one.
With regard to the initial claim, that concrete does not conduct,
it's the same issue with both. If concrete did not conduct, a
concrete encased electrode for an earth ground would be useless
and you would not get shocked standing on a concrete floor.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-07 15:25:14 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by trader_4
Post by TimR
Two separate ideas being debated here.
1. Ufer grounding as an appropriate or legal method of grounding your system.
2. Concrete floors considered to be at ground potential.
For the latter, I have always been told that you must consider a concrete floor to be at ground, and therefore refrain from touching any hot wires.
I have not attempted to measure that myself and don't know the source of the claim. But I've seen it in a number of electrical safety classes, so if it is an urban legend it is a well distributed one.
With regard to the initial claim, that concrete does not conduct,
it's the same issue with both. If concrete did not conduct, a
concrete encased electrode for an earth ground would be useless
and you would not get shocked standing on a concrete floor.
You don't. Try it. Or try placing a lightbulb or meter instead of yourself. One end on live, the other end with a steel plate on the concrete floor the same size as your bare feet. Show me a video of this working.
--
Thank you velly much. I'm not Wan King the chef, I'm Fu King the owner.
Rod Speed
2017-01-05 21:19:28 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by F Murtz
Post by Dean Hoffman
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
It was more about getting an electric shock by standing on the floor
of your house while touching something live. This was suggested by
someone recently as being a danger. I just measured some concrete
to make sure I wasn't being ignorant, and it was off the scale
(>20MOhms)
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
My house is on a slab
So is mine.
Post by F Murtz
and I get five volt tingle from the taps when I am in the shower.
I don't. What's the detail on the plumbing ? Mine is
soldered copper, mostly but not entirely yorkshire fittings.
Post by F Murtz
I suspect that when it was built they did not bond the steel mesh to
earth,
Very unlikely. I know mine isnt because I did the
mesh and slab myself and I don't get that effect.
Post by F Murtz
which they are supposed to do now.
Gotta cite on that ?

What are you doing hot water wise ?
Vir Campestris
2017-01-06 21:58:59 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Dean Hoffman
I guess one doesn't test earth grounding with a regular ohm meter.
The instructor at one of my code refresher classes asked once if
anyone had
the correct type of tester. No one did out of at least 50
electricians. Earth grounding
is primarily for damage from lightning. He also had a diagram showing
how little current would flow through the earth if a well motor had a
short to the frame. The resistance was so high that there was no way
even a tiny fuse would blow if there was a short.
<http://support.fluke.com/find-sales/Download/Asset/2633834_6115_ENG_A_W.PDF>
I like that link.

Page 5 has a table with ground electrode depths ranging between 3 and
1000 meters.

Yes, meters. I'll assume they mean metres, which is well over half a
mile... maybe they do mean a pile of 1000 testers?

Hmm... I wonder what they do mean?

Page 6 says "Just watch your units" :)

Andy
Fredxxx
2017-01-04 19:42:53 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On 04/01/2017 18:48, burfordTjustice wrote:

<snip>
Post by burfordTjustice
plus he is the local dole whore loon.
And you aren't?
trader_4
2017-01-04 19:43:20 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by burfordTjustice
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 10:42:34 -0800
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete
based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good
insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with
PEX. That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
plus he is the local dole whore loon.
I see, you're so dumb you think the laws of physics, the
conductivity of concrete is different in the UK than in the USA.
Vir Campestris
2017-01-06 21:51:56 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by burfordTjustice
"James Wilkinson Sword" is in the UK...different rules
And you aren't?

(Oh. Someone's cross posted this lot to a global list as well as the UK one)
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 20:01:06 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by mike
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based
house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Sorry, can't find the post it was mentioned in.
Can't help with a link, but I recently replaced my water main with PEX.
That broke the ground to the house and wouldn't pass inspection.
Long story short, research indicated that using rebar in concrete
was a trend in establishing a safety ground. Apparently, there's
enough conductive salt and water in concrete to make it work,
as long as the concrete sits on the ground and you're not in
the desert. Contact resistance is high, but there's a lot of area.
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
Why did you want inspection? When you do work on your house, you don't tell anyone.
--
Pub sign: Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 20:47:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 20:01:06 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by mike
I followed the code and installed two ground rods.
I did some impedance measurements between the rods and the
electrical system ground (before connecting) and determined that the
"grounding" was insufficient to do anything more than
dissipate static electricity, but the
inspector liked it.
I'd guess that hooking to the rebar is at least as good.
Why did you want inspection? When you do work on your house, you don't tell anyone.
Idiot! <tsk>
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"I don't wear underwear, but boxers are more comfortable than briefs. Why
would you want it clamped in?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-04 21:04:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 21:11:44 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.

Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
--
In 1839, the imperial Chinese commissioner Lin Zexu wrote a letter to Queen Victoria warning that, unless the British stopped supplying opium to China, he would cut off rhubarb supplies to Britain, killing everyone through mass constipation.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 21:35:24 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended
above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
Darn, why do so many Yanks fall for you insipid trolling? Any explanation of
this, Birdbrain?
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) deep "thinking":
"I don't wear underwear, but boxers are more comfortable than briefs. Why
would you want it clamped in?"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-04 22:14:30 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite, hurricane and tornado
problems?
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-04 22:22:05 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
--
What's the difference between a naked white woman and a naked black woman?
One's on the cover of Playboy and the other's on the cover of National Geographic.
The Peeler
2017-01-04 22:51:06 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
Really, were you BORN that way, poor idiot? <BG>
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's sociopathic world.
"Why not just shoot on sight? Bears are dangerous and should be treated
the same as a Muslim with a bomb. Destroy it"
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 00:05:58 UTC
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On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 00:13:04 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
--
I can kind of understand why Muslims get so frustrated.
I mean, how many more people are they going to have
to murder before everyone understands that Islam
is the religion of peace?
The Peeler
2017-01-05 00:28:25 UTC
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On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Yes, it is, when it proves what a babbling idiot you are!
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
What was your psychiatrists official diagnosis of your mental condition,
Birdbrain? Quotes from your psychiatrists, even of those that gave up on
you, are welcome!
--
Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic "mind" at work:
"Satan is god's wife. Woman are evil."
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 01:32:03 UTC
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On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
Under a decent building code they will all stand or blow away
together.
The roof is continuously tied through the walls to the foundation
In a concrete block building that will be continuous rebar from the
foundation to the poured tie beam on the top of the wall, then
strapped to the roof trusses. A typical 1800 sq/ft house will have
almost 100,000 pounds of uplift protection at the roof.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 01:38:07 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
Under a decent building code they will all stand or blow away
together.
The roof is continuously tied through the walls to the foundation
In a concrete block building that will be continuous rebar from the
foundation to the poured tie beam on the top of the wall, then
strapped to the roof trusses. A typical 1800 sq/ft house will have
almost 100,000 pounds of uplift protection at the roof.
I see. We don't have so much wind here, so my next question is, why are modern houses in the UK starting to have concrete foundations like yours? Old ones, you go under the floor, you can crawl around on dirt and fix the pipes and wires. New ones, you can't get down, it's just solid.
--
Computers can never replace human stupidity.
The Peeler
2017-01-05 01:43:20 UTC
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On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:38:07 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
Under a decent building code they will all stand or blow away
together.
The roof is continuously tied through the walls to the foundation
In a concrete block building that will be continuous rebar from the
foundation to the poured tie beam on the top of the wall, then
strapped to the roof trusses. A typical 1800 sq/ft house will have
almost 100,000 pounds of uplift protection at the roof.
I see. We don't have so much wind here,
Obviously they also don't have too much brain where you live, Birdbrain!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange world:
"If the human is inferior to the dog, we don't care for the dead human."
MID: <***@red.lan>
g***@aol.com
2017-01-05 04:30:02 UTC
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On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:38:07 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
Under a decent building code they will all stand or blow away
together.
The roof is continuously tied through the walls to the foundation
In a concrete block building that will be continuous rebar from the
foundation to the poured tie beam on the top of the wall, then
strapped to the roof trusses. A typical 1800 sq/ft house will have
almost 100,000 pounds of uplift protection at the roof.
I see. We don't have so much wind here, so my next question is, why are modern houses in the UK starting to have concrete foundations like yours? Old ones, you go under the floor, you can crawl around on dirt and fix the pipes and wires. New ones, you can't get down, it's just solid.
Maybe they think global warming is going to bring you tropical weather
some day. Honestly most of the US does not really have an effective
wind code either but as people start wondering why a summer squall or
dust devil blows their houses to smithereens and a Cat 1 or even 2
here does minimal damage to newer houses here, they start to ponder
why. Most of the hurricane damage pictures you see from Florida is 50
year old homes or, more likely trailers.
I suppose Florida building codes may spread, if for no other reason
that the insurance companies will push them.
I know when I was building in Maryland, the main force people thought
about was gravity with little more than a passing glance at wind
pressure (maybe built to 60-70 MPH) and nothing at all about uplift.
I am in the 150 MPH zone.
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-05 19:40:54 UTC
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Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 01:38:07 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 00:13:04 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 22:22:05 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 21:11:44 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
On Wed, 04 Jan 2017 17:58:12 -0000, "James Wilkinson Sword"
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Not really true, particularly if it is damp
If your floor is damp all the way through, you have bigger problems.
Concrete floors are for garages, houses should have wood floors suspended above the ground. What century is the USA living in?
One where we have not solved the termite,
Chemicals are your friend.
Fine when they work and don't migrate to the ground water.
Not my problem.
Post by g***@aol.com
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
hurricane and tornado problems?
Those tend to affect walls and roofs.
If your floor is off the ground, it will just be part of the debris
field when the wind gets up under it.
If the walls are gone, why do you care about your floor?
Under a decent building code they will all stand or blow away
together.
The roof is continuously tied through the walls to the foundation
In a concrete block building that will be continuous rebar from the
foundation to the poured tie beam on the top of the wall, then
strapped to the roof trusses. A typical 1800 sq/ft house will have
almost 100,000 pounds of uplift protection at the roof.
I see. We don't have so much wind here, so my next question is, why are modern houses in the UK starting to have concrete foundations like yours? Old ones, you go under the floor, you can crawl around on dirt and fix the pipes and wires. New ones, you can't get down, it's just solid.
Maybe they think global warming is going to bring you tropical weather
some day. Honestly most of the US does not really have an effective
wind code either but as people start wondering why a summer squall or
dust devil blows their houses to smithereens and a Cat 1 or even 2
here does minimal damage to newer houses here, they start to ponder
why. Most of the hurricane damage pictures you see from Florida is 50
year old homes or, more likely trailers.
I suppose Florida building codes may spread, if for no other reason
that the insurance companies will push them.
I know when I was building in Maryland, the main force people thought
about was gravity with little more than a passing glance at wind
pressure (maybe built to 60-70 MPH) and nothing at all about uplift.
I am in the 150 MPH zone.
I thought the general idea in America was to make them NOT wind proof, but easy and cheap to rebuild?
--
You don't appreciate a lot of stuff in school until you get older.
Little things like being spanked every day by a middle-aged woman.
Stuff you pay good money for later in life. -- Elmo Phillips
The Peeler
2017-01-05 20:11:23 UTC
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Raw Message
On Thu, 05 Jan 2017 19:40:54 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by g***@aol.com
Maybe they think global warming is going to bring you tropical weather
some day. Honestly most of the US does not really have an effective
wind code either but as people start wondering why a summer squall or
dust devil blows their houses to smithereens and a Cat 1 or even 2
here does minimal damage to newer houses here, they start to ponder
why. Most of the hurricane damage pictures you see from Florida is 50
year old homes or, more likely trailers.
I suppose Florida building codes may spread, if for no other reason
that the insurance companies will push them.
I know when I was building in Maryland, the main force people thought
about was gravity with little more than a passing glance at wind
pressure (maybe built to 60-70 MPH) and nothing at all about uplift.
I am in the 150 MPH zone.
I thought
There's the snag, Birdbrain!
--
Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) sociopathic "mind" at work:
"Satan is god's wife. Woman are evil."
MID: <***@red.lan>
Tekkie®
2017-01-05 20:57:15 UTC
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James Wilkinson Sword posted for all of us...
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Negative, if one looks at an AM radio station the tower is used as the
antenna. Note a big ceramic insulator between the tower and the foundation.
the is a spark gap on the insulator for lighting. If the transmitter is
active then a non conductive ladder to climb the tower. That is why
maintenance is performed at night because they are off the air.
--
Tekkie
James Wilkinson Sword
2017-01-06 01:26:24 UTC
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Post by Tekkie®
James Wilkinson Sword posted for all of us...
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete bas=
ed house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Post by Tekkie®
Negative, if one looks at an AM radio station the tower is used as the=
antenna. Note a big ceramic insulator between the tower and the founda=
tion.
Post by Tekkie®
the is a spark gap on the insulator for lighting. If the transmitter i=
s
Post by Tekkie®
active then a non conductive ladder to climb the tower. That is why
maintenance is performed at night because they are off the air.
The base can get wet.

-- =

Hipatitis (n): Terminal coolness.
The Peeler
2017-01-06 11:32:52 UTC
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On Fri, 06 Jan 2017 01:26:24 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson"),
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Post by Tekkie®
Post by James Wilkinson Sword
Somebody in one of these two groups recently said that a concrete based
house means you're earthed. Concrete is a bloody good insulator!
Negative, if one looks at an AM radio station the tower is used as the
antenna. Note a big ceramic insulator between the tower and the foundation.
the is a spark gap on the insulator for lighting. If the transmitter is
active then a non conductive ladder to climb the tower. That is why
maintenance is performed at night because they are off the air.
The base can get wet.
Your idiotic claims have sufficiently and repeatedly been disproved (with
documents, too), you endlessly blathering idiot!
--
More of Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL) strange sociopathic
world:
"Boat fell over, the weakest died, Darwin wins, end of story."
MID: <***@red.lan>
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